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emilycross
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PostSubject: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:28 am

Welcome to our thread dedicated to our resident published author Rosy Thorton, who is the author of three published books; Crossed Wires, More than love letters and Hearts and Minds

This is the place to come and discuss everything Rosy - we all know how hard it is to get published, but its even harder to get a readership! So come here and show your support cheers

Heres a little bit more about . . . .


ROSY THORNTON


Bio:

I was brought up in a village in rural Suffolk, England – close to the town of Ipswich where ‘More Than Love letters’ is set. I studied Law at the University of Cambridge, where I stayed on to take a PhD, and where I have since been a lecturer for the past twenty years. I am a Fellow of Emmanuel College. I am married with two daughters aged 12 and 9. Teaching Law full-time, being a mum and writing novels doesn’t leave me lot of spare time, but my main interests are dogs (we have two spaniels) and supporting Ipswich Town Football Club.

This is Rosy's website: http://www.rosythornton.com

How She came to write the book:

I never wrote a word of fiction until the age of 40, nor had any urge to do so, but then was inspired to action by watching the BBC’s television dramatisation of Elizabeth Gaskell’s classic novel ‘North and South’ at the end of 2004. I joined a fan site where others were writing fanfic based on Gaskell’s novel, and decided to have a go myself – and within to months I had written a full novel-length sequel to ‘North and South’! That got me started, and when the fanfic was finished I went straight on and began my own independent novel – which became ‘More Than Love Letters’.

The book has a modern setting but both the plot and the characters owe something to Elizabeth Gaskell. My Margaret is based very much on Margaret Hale from ‘North and South’: a Victorian heroine transplanted into the 21st century, complete with translucent skin, dark curls and burning moral zeal. And it’s no coincidence that the hero is called Richard - after the gorgeous Richard Armitage, who played the lead in the BBC adaptation of ‘North and South’.

‘More Than Love Letters’:





Written entirely in epistolary format (a combination of letters, e-mails, press cuttings, etc.), ‘More Than Love Letters’ tells the story of a young primary school teacher, Margaret Hayton, who writes campaigning letters to her Member of Parliament, New Labour smoothie Richard Slater MP. She meets him while lobbying on behalf of a young asylum seeker, and the two eventually fall in love – with no little confusion and misunderstanding along the way. Around the central pair are woven the lives of Margaret’s confidantes: her friend Becs, who is working her way through the men of Manchester in alphabetical order, and her landlady Cora, pining for her husband who’s away working on an oil rig in the North Sea.

Book details:

‘More Than Love Letters’ was published by Headline Review in hardback in 2006 and paperback in 2007. The paperback is available from Amazon UK here:

Amazon UK

and in the US from Amazon.com here:

Amazon US

Publisher’s website:

http://www.headline.co.uk/

(but there’s very little there right now because they are just in the middle of revamping it.)

An extract from ‘More Than Love Letters’ can be downloaded here:

http://www.lovereading.co.uk/book/1904/More-Than-Love-Letters-by-Rosy-Thornton.html

(The site, Lovereading, requires you to register before downloading extracts, but it is entirely free.)

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:30 am

Congrats on the publications Rosy!! cheers

I haven't purchased your book yet (but i will be Wink ) but to just start the book/ author discussion

i was wondering why and how did you decide to use an epistolary format?

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Fri Mar 06, 2009 6:45 am

The suggestion came from an agent, actually - in one of my extensive collection of rejection letters. I had been submitting my Victorian 'North and South' fanfic, and this agent (I’m ashamed to say I’ve forgotten who it was) said that the letters I had worked into the narrative worked well, and had I considered writing a novel entirely in epistolary form? I gave it a whirl for my next attempt - which turned into 'More Than Love Letters'.

The epistolary format is a great one for the rookie novelist. There is no difficult connecting narrative to write, no tricky ‘point of view’ issues to navigate: everything comes straight across in the unmediated voices of the characters themselves. That gives it a lovely immediacy, as a way of writing. The construction of plot is made simpler because it can be broken down into separate, manageable little building blocks, which can be added, subtracted and moved about without the whole thing unravelling like knitting, the way conventional narrative can. And best of all - absolutely no dialogue! (I find dialogue really hard.)

By the way, thanks so much, Emily, for setting up this thread. It is hugely appreciated!

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Thu Apr 09, 2009 2:14 pm

Hi rosy, i'm in the process of reading the book, but maybe you could tell us a little about the publishing and editing side of the novel. for example, how was the cover of your novel chosen, did you have a say? is the title yours or did you have to change the original one? etc.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Fri Apr 10, 2009 12:45 pm

Hi, Emily - thanks for your questions.

It was my agent who did the editing on the book. What I originally sent to him was a very raw first draft – I knew nothing about the fact you are meant to work over and improve your text. It was only 65,000 words long, for a start, whereas the finished article is just over 80,000. And it was honestly pretty awful. For one thing, as he pointed out, there was ‘always plenty going on but nothing you could actually call a plot’! We worked through two further drafts together over a period of two months before he felt it was ready to submit. Then, when it was bought by the publisher, the editor didn’t feel she needed to do anything more to it at all.

I originally wrote the novel under the working title ‘Asylum’. I knew nothing about genre or marketing, and it never occurred to me that this was the title for a heavy, bleak, high-literary sort of novel and not for light satire or romantic comedy! My editor quickly disabused me and we worked through various possibilities. She wanted the word ‘love’ in the title, to appeal to a romance-reading audience, but I was quite keen for something that would also reflect the political satire aspect of the book. For a while we were going with ‘From Westminster With Love’ - it was even on Amazon for pre-order with that title for a while – but then the publisher’s marketing people aid it would never sell in the US with that tile. Apparently, they reckoned, you Americans don’t know what Westminster is. (Yeah, right - and we in the UK don’t lap up ‘The West Wing’ on TV!) In the end the title ‘More Than Love Letters was a compromise – and I agreed as long as I got the picture of Big Ben on the cover!

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sat Apr 11, 2009 4:24 am

Your agent sounds lovely and very hands on, could you deal us a little about your experience of dealing with him and how long it took for you to get accepted by a) agent b) publisher? You said you got some rejections, it might be uplifting for us unpublished people to hear about your progress.

i love the 'from westminster with love' title but i can see the publisher's perspective because even here in Ireland, the title 'more than love letters' is more universal. Its great you got some say on sticking big ben on the cover too. often you hear authors don't get consulted at all when developing the cover design

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sat Apr 11, 2009 12:08 pm

With looking for an agent, I began by doing what you are supposed to do: I researched it carefully and selected the agents who represented authors whose work I thought was similar to mine. I sent them my proposal – and they all rejected me. Then, in batches, I wrote to every fiction agent in the Writers and Artists’ Yearbook – and they all rejected me, too. Then, by mistake, I wrote to an agent who was listed at the time as handling only non-fiction (‘dur’, as my daughters would say) and it just so happened to be looking to expand into fiction. He took me on, and we’ve learned the fiction ropes together. He’s completely wonderful. (Robert Dudley of the Robert Dudley Agency, in case anyone is in the UK and looking for an agent.) I think the whole process took about six months.

After we'd edited it into shape he began sending it out to pubilshers. It was maybe only four to six weeks before Headline (my publisher) asked for the full manuscript, but then they sat on it from October to March, passing it round various editors, then to the head of fiction, then finally to the marketing department to see if it would be saleable. It's a long and painful process before a contract gets offered at a big publishing house, and a maunscript can be dropped at any stage. It was a scary few months. But smaller houses, I think, may make faster decisions.

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sat Apr 11, 2009 1:31 pm

I haven't read your book yet - I'm kinda poor, so when I find it I'll snatch it up, but I AM curious. How do you even FIND an editor? Or a Publisher? I mean my little Writing Circle consists of me and my laptop and my backup harddrive and... well, this forum. (Assuming I ever get Wings working again) how would I go about finding a publisher? Do you find an editor first?

This is so cool, thanks for sharing with us!

<3 Ren
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sat Apr 11, 2009 11:56 pm

Hi, Ren!

The usual route (and the route I took) is to find an agent first, who then places your book with a publisher (by sending them the proposal and also by sweet talking them, etc.!). The problem is that many publishers - and most large ones - no longer accept 'unagented' submissions of manscripts directly from authors. They use literary agents as a screeing process, basically - so authors have to get themslevs signed up with an agent (who will often help them edit the manuscript into shape, as mine did, before beginning to submit it) before they will be considered at all by a publisher. Even where publishers will still accept direct submissions, that's a bit of a lottery (known as the 'slush pile') and if you do have an agent you have a much better chance of getting more than a cursory glance. Literary agents don't charge for the initial work they do for you (editing, or tryng to place your work) - they just take 15 percent of your earnings IF your book is published.

To find an agent, most authors work through published directories and lists, the best one being the Writers and Artists Yearbook, which is avaliable for free online as well as being in hard copy in bookshops. The listings tell you what genres the agent represents, and what format your submission to them should be in, etc.

Editors are the staff at the publishers who wor with the authors to produce the book. They do edit (though in my case mine has only really edited the third novel, as the first two were edited in advance of submission by my agent, so that my editor didnlt have any further changes - it's confusing!) but they do everything else, too, co-ordinating the choice of title and cover, the cover blurb, amd the productuon and marketing side. At a large publishing house, your book will need to find an agent ready to take it on before it will be taken on. Thta's not your job, it's a matter for in-house dceision - but your agent can help the process along by sending the manuscript in the first place to a particular editor whom he/she thinks may like your work.

I hope that clarifies the process a bit for you. I agree it's all rather confusing to an outsider - and I certainly knew very little about how it all works before I began to think of submitting my first book.

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Apr 12, 2009 1:10 am

No, that was very useful. Thank you! I think for now, though, I need to worry about actually finishing a story! :p Thanks again!
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Apr 12, 2009 3:01 am

True - that has to come first, I guess!

Rosy x
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Apr 12, 2009 3:29 am

Rosy, my memory might be going a bit wrong, but do i remember you mentioning that a book of yours is being realised this year?

why don't you tell us about it? and maybe the release date etc. so we might organise an event party?

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Apr 12, 2009 11:32 pm

Thanks, Emily! Yes, my third novel, 'Crossed Wires' is out this month. The official 'press' release date in the UK is 20th April, but actually it's been availabe on Amazon and in some UK shops for about a week or so.

It's a romantic comedy - a bit of a modern fairy story, really, the lightest of my three books to date. Peter is a Cambridge professor who crashes his car into a tree stump when swerving to avoid a cat, and Mina is the girl in the Sheffield call centre who deals with his insurance claim. The two get talking, and a friendship develops. The book essentially tracks their parallel lives. It's about duality and coincidence, one-ness and two-ness, about the things which separate us and the things which bring us together.

This is it:
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Crossed-Wires-Rosy-Thornton/dp/075534555X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1239600795&sr=1-1

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Wed Apr 15, 2009 8:44 pm

Rosy,
Thank you for posting all this wonderful information! I finished reading your book More Than Love Letters and must admit, was surprised at how the book flowed. I didn't think it would be possible, I imagined chunks of information that wouldn't blend etc. BUT it was nothing like that. I read it like a modern day Pride and Prejudice. I usually steer away from titles with "love" in them...not the romantic sort these days. However, I am glad that The Book Club gave me a chance to read your book. I am looking forward to your new book. I really like the cover too.

Tulsa
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:38 am

Thanks very much, Tulsa! Your kind comments are much appreciated.

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Tue May 12, 2009 5:57 pm

This sounds so great, Rosy. Congrats on the sell! I'll have to pick it up.
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Wed May 13, 2009 9:38 am

Thanks, bj!

Rosy
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Jun 21, 2009 12:44 am

I had a nice piece of news on Friday. My editor likes the book that I finished and submitted to her last month, so it is definitely going ahead with a hardback out in the UK in Nov/Dec and the paperback to follow in spring/early summer 2010. It is about a woman who moves to France to start a new life in a remote mountain village. It has not title yet, though my editor has suggested 'A Scent of Jasmine'.
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Sun Jun 21, 2009 5:24 am

Congratulations!! thats brilliant!!

How does 'a scent of jasmine' relate to the story (i know we were discussing french knots previously on the 'title thread'?

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Mon Jun 22, 2009 12:02 am

Thanks, Emily!

'A Scent of Jasmine' is one of the chapter titles in the book. It relates to the MC's mother's death - so it isn't central but is certainly a factor. My only doubt is that the jasmine in question just happens to be in her garden - one of very few imported 'garden' shrubs - and indeed the point is made in the text how few non-culinary and non-native plants are growing there. So it isn't a plant which makes me think of the place she lives at all - it's a native of China or north Africa, an makes me think of heat and sun, whereas where my MC lives is wet and bleak. I also wonder whether 'A Scent of Jasmine' makes the book sound like a category romance (which it isn't)? Like this one, for example:

http://www.fictiondb.com/author/natasha-dunne~a-scent-of-jasmine~40584~b.htm

What does the title suggest to you?

Rosy x
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Mon Jun 22, 2009 4:58 am

to be honest, it doesn't really 'do' anything for me, in relation the story. I'm not great at title picking to be honest but i would think something to do with travel, abroad, france would be more central for the title.

"Three ways to *insert name of place* - the mc, her sister and her mother?

or "three ways to the heart" "three ways to home"


aw the blogosphere delivers again http://pbackwriter.blogspot.com/2009/06/entitled-ten.html - Rosy, heres a post about titles and links to helpful sites Smile

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Wed Jun 24, 2009 6:08 am

Thanks very much for that link, Emily! In the end the title is for the publisher to decide, not me, but it's nice to have ideas to feed in for consideration.

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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Wed Jun 24, 2009 7:25 pm

Rosy,

Congrats on your publication! I actually started to read your book {before my little sister destroyed my copy and I had to throw it out sadly -sorry ><-} and it was very good....even though I only read a few pages ^^.

I'm very envious of your acomplishments!

Me, myself, have an agent...but he's not a 'real' agent. By that I mean, he is a Magistrate -soon to be judge- that my mother works for. He asked me if he could be my agent and take care of all the leagal things for my book. Both me and my mother trust him so I agreed, but I think he's stumped ><. I'm not sure he knows what to do AS my agent, so I've been researching it for him.

Any information you think i should tell him?

Any and all insight welcomed, and again, congrates on your publication!

~Akurei Enzeru

P.S. I'm Looking for another copy of your books as we speak! They will make a great addition to my Library!
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Mon Jun 29, 2009 11:46 pm

Thanks, Akurei - and I'm sorry your sister ate my book!

Having somebody who has never acted as a literary agent before is tricky, since their main job is (i) to knock the manuscript into shape (does he have any editorial experience?) and then (ii) to pitch your book to publishers (does he have any contacts in the fiction publishing world?), before (ii)negotiating your contracts with the publisher for which you sign. Sounds like this person could maybe manage (iii) all right, but if you are as yet unpublished it's (i) and (ii) which matter most to you at this stage!

On the other hand, having any agent at all does open some doors. There are lots of publishers who will not look at unagented submissions. So the mere fact of having your submission sent in on a literary agent's headed paper (however little experience he/she may have) will at least get your manuscript on to an editor's desk. The theory is that the more well-known your agent - the more track record he/she has - the more notice editors will take when a submission arrives from theta agent. It might jump you up their to-read queue. But they do at least look at all their submissions, and if the work is good enough, they'll want it, whoever the agent is, that's my belief.

Good luck!
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PostSubject: Re: The Rosy Thornton Thread   Tue Jun 30, 2009 6:20 am

Thank your Rose!

I talked it over with my agent and we decided that if i can get a more well known agent to like my book it would be best to try and get them as my agent. So I've been sending queries the past three days ><

I hope someone likes me!

~AKurei ENzeru
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